Empowering young voices through creative direction with DINES®

DINES® is a Creative Director and international keynote speaker based in London, UK. He's currently active as founder and Creative Director of multi-award winning creative agency, Studio BLUP London.

In this episode, DINES® talks about how he founded his own creative studio at a very young age, how he inspires young people today to get into the arts, and his new initiative, BLUP Academy, an online learning resource for young creatives all around the country!

Instagram: @_dines
Website: https://dines.london/

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Transcript

Matt: Hello, and welcome to the Teach, Inspire, Create podcast. I'm your host, Matt Mosley, Chief Examiner for Art and Design at UAL Awarding Body. Each episode, I speak to artists and creative industry leaders about three main themes, teaching, inspiring, and creating. We talk about their experiences of teaching and being taught, who or what inspires them, and we explore how they foster creativity in their work with the hope of showing you that there are infinite ways to be creative in the arts.

Matt: Today my guest is DINES. He is a Creative Director and international keynote speaker based in London, UK. He's currently active as founder and Creative Director of multi-award winning creative agency, Studio BLUP London. I'm going to be speaking to Dines about how he founded his own creative studio at a very young age, how he inspires young people today to get into the arts, and his new initiative, BLUP Academy, an online learning resource for young creatives all around the country.

Matt: There is a transcript available for this episode. Please click the link in the episode description so you can read as you listen.

Matt: Hello, Dines. 

Dines: Hello, mate. How you doing, mate? 

Matt: I'm very well, thank you. Thank you ever so much for joining us today on the Teach, Inspire, Create podcast. It's brilliant for us to have you. Can't wait to hear all about Studio BLUP and all the things that you [00:01:30] do. So to start with, we like to sort of wind people back to an experience that maybe shaped you on your road to where you are today.

Dines: Wicked. Well, it kind of started quite really early on. Monk Richard, probably legend, uh, gave me his old, like, Atari and, uh, started to do like homework on it, and I think I was about what, 12 years old. And I discovered this program, it was like this like dodgy, um, Microsoft paint esque, but for the Atari.

Dines: And at the time I was proper into Pokemon to, like, draw it just by hand anyway, so I found this this program and all of a sudden like I just started drawing Pikachu on this Atari and it was like the most pixelated thing ever. But somehow I just hacked it to make it look like a proper 3d and stuff, and I also my other cousin he was designing a Bjork logo on his Atari when I went to visit them in Yorkshire. And I remember just sitting there with my cousin, Aaron, sitting there for ages and just looking at him just tracing this Bjork logo, just [00:02:30] outlined it, filled it with all these colours and stuff.

Dines: And I was just mesmerised. I think that's like how I first hooked into what digital art was for me, and I was just like, I need to learn how to do this. This is going to be my passion. 

Matt: You then sort of segway into graffiti, or graffiti becomes part of your kind of creative process, doesn't it?

Dines: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dines: It's a lot of my family influencing. So my cousin Paul, he was like a bit of a graffiti artist, like a little illegally, you know what I mean, in Northwest, in Northwest London, right? And yeah, yeah, so he used to be out on the [00:03:00] street and I remember, like, him just writing his tag on this bit of paper. I was like, wow, man, like this is actually like an art craft.

Dines: This is a, this is your hand drawing letters, but it looks so smooth the way you've done it and I was just again mesmerized by how he just handwritten his tag. So then I was like teach me, and then he wrote out the alphabet and I just literally every day like just tracing this ABCD like on the graffiti letters. And all of a sudden I just got the knack of it and it just became natural flow.

Dines: And then as I got a bit better, you know, it was almost like competitive, we [00:03:30] could have the best like design kind of thing. We started kind of like spray painting on empty walls in the back of his garage and stuff, and every time I saw, like, a blank empty space, I was like, okay, I need to put my mark on this.

Dines: I need to do something that's so impressive that when people look past, walk past it, they stop, look at it, take a picture and walk on. And I think that was always like my mission to make sure like if I'm going to do graffiti, I'm going to make sure it's, like, a beautiful piece and actually hone my craft in that and then hopefully something will span from there.

Matt: Consistency is a really important [00:04:00] thing to you in terms of your own creative development in a way that you sort of promote and support creative development in young artists, designers. Is consistency a big part of the creative process for you? 

Dines: It's spot on. It goes back to obviously, when I was writing those graffiti letters every day, just repeating it, repeating it, back of my maths book, back of my English book, and just drawing, sketching. Later on, when I started discovering digital art, I challenged myself to create a piece of artwork every day. I've been in this game for 15 years, and to this day, still producing [00:04:30] thousands of images of work. It has to be about the consistency, finding that core of pure love that you enjoy doing it, and just gripping onto that every day. And you're successively just innovating, you're successively building who you are as a creative. And it's almost like, it almost becomes an addiction, because you want to chase that fix, you want to chase that adrenaline rush of creating something new and feeling that gut feeling of well, this is pretty decent.

Matt: You're obviously improving your skills and your output, but you're also developing that sense of [00:05:00] confidence in yourself that you're starting to understand your own work. When I used to teach the students at college, one of the things that we used to promote was doing something for your practice every day. However small it is, whether you're traveling all day, just do some drawings on the train, you just make something towards your practice every single day.

Dines: Speaking to a couple of students the other day, and their thing is about the pressure of trying to create and trying to force it every day, even if they've got a mental block. And I thought about this and I was like, I've been in that situation so many times. I said to myself, what [00:05:30] is it that I can get over this mental block? I said to him, all you need to do is just think about your design. Like you don't have to physically get a sketchbook and design it and create something.

Dines: The fact that you're thinking about it is enough because you think about it long enough, it's going to come out on the pen and paper on your computer. And that's still a step of creating something every day. 

Matt: That's a really great strategy for people to hear, I think, because that mental block is definitely something that's massively prevalent, isn't it?

Matt: You've always set yourself goals [00:06:00] with what you want to achieve with your work, whether they're quite small things or quite big things. What are some of those goals that you kind of set yourself and achieve?

Dines: Yeah. So growing up, like I said, there was no one that did what I wanted to do that looked like me, who spoke like me and just who I can look up to and be like, I need to be that person in this industry.

Dines: So in a way I had to kind of make it up in my head. So I was like, okay, so I want to be like this person in business. I want to be like this person in art. I want to inspire this [00:06:30] many people in my industry. So how can I combine that and make that my mission and my goal. So every day I was just like, looking at these design magazines at university and ripping up pages of like, creative studios and work and stuff that's done for brands and we call that the vision board now, but at the time I was just like collecting it in a folder.

Dines: And I was like, every year when I was featured in a magazine, I was like, okay, this, this is a vision ticked off. Let me go for the next magazine, next magazine. That's when print was, like, big then. And then when I saw big design studios [00:07:00] doing a feature in a magazine, like inside the design lab, I was like, I want that one day. So what do I need to do to get to that stage? So it's almost, it's like, this is the, this is the base level. This is where I need to be, and then once I hit that, I realized, there needs to be more. There needs to be something that I can do to change the industry or inspire more people, because all my goals were a bit more selfish and where I want to be now I'm there says like what can I do to change the industry to help others?

Matt: So do you create sort of [00:07:30] plans? 

Dines: Hundred percent. So with Studio BLUP, it's actually a good vehicle to build a brand to allow me to be in different avenues, right? So for example, I'll create a vision board every year, maybe like New Year's Eve, I'll sit down and I'll look at all the images I've saved on Instagram, right?

Dines: And I'll screen grab them and put them on this, like, this, like, on Google Slides and then print it out. And I'll work out, okay, so, I need to win three awards, but not just awards for design [00:08:00] craft, like, you know, that's, I want to win, like, awards that actually are helping, say, change people's lives. So what do I need to do?

Dines: Who are the people that I need to meet to use my design skills and my knowledge to actually change these people's lives? Another one would be, how do I, say, raise this much money for charity and how do I use my design to maybe sell merch to then raise that enough money to like actually make a difference? At the beginning, you need to be selfish. You need to build up who your brand is and what you need to do. So your goals need to be [00:08:30] ruthless and they need to be, like, selfish, right?

Dines: So it could be you know, I want to be speaking in front of a thousand people. I want to make thousands of pounds selling work. I want to have a successful career journey. Once you reach those goals, it's what you do with it that counts.[00:09:00]

Matt: Now that you have achieved a certain level of status of experience, it's now working for you, so you know, you can direct your own value system and have that impact through design. And I know that pressure is something that you're focused on helping young people to deal with in their creative work. Do you feel like having that purpose that's bigger than just you and your work helped you to deal with some of that?

Dines: Yeah, well lucky I've got my business partner Alex, my best friend at uni as well, so an amazing team that helped me achieve these visions and think big and knowing that I've got a team to help me achieve these things. So for example, me and Al would just sit down at the pub for like hours, [00:09:30] just talking absolute nonsense about what we want to do.

Dines: What about if we try this? What about if we try this? And he's thinking like, okay, how do I make this happen? And then I realized early on just having a business partner as the integrator, he can just take what I've, I've said, churn it out and then make it happen. So that allows me to think high level, knowing that it can be done and brought to life in the real world.

Matt: So can I ask a little bit about how Studio BLUP started then?

Dines: Yeah, yeah. So I studied at Solent University. In my second year [00:10:00] university, we had a project called Personal Branding. So we had to design your like, your own business card, your own logo, your own website. I was like, I'm not wasting time here. I want to design a company rather than just designing a Dines thing and wasting time. So anyway, so I thought I'm gonna call it Studio BLUP. Now Studio BLUP was my four best letters to do when I was competing. So B L U P were my favorite letters, and they put it together and it sounded like a word. I was like, oh, this is interesting. And then the word Studio made us, made me sound [00:10:30] like bigger than what I was. So anyway, so I did this personal branding as a studio branding, designed a business card, the logo, made it look sick. Obviously I failed it because it was about personal branding, not about a company, and that's when I realized at the time I was like, ah, okay, like I need to play the game and do stuff that obviously the university wants me to do. But what I was using that time for was when I finished university, I had a brand ready to then speak to other companies about designing logos for them under the word Studio BLUP.

Matt: So this idea of actually being more [00:11:00] than just yourself, you are a one person studio aren't you? Because the Dines brand is able to bring more people in than that.

Dines: That's the most important thing. It is about brand and I've realized that and what does your brand stand for now? Now originally, obviously Studio BLUP was… it effectively was just me but it's like an alias and the reason why, don't say, I hid behind the name BLUP. I feel if I produce work and it got criticized, they're criticising BLUP, not Dines.

Dines: So then I also use that as my shield and also my like, [00:11:30] my comfort blanket. So I could put stuff out there and then people like, I love BLUP work, that's so sick. Or they were like, I don't really get it, it's a bit wild, but it didn't affect me because they're talking about BLUP. And I think again, it was just like a happy accident that that kind of mindset happened because as a creative, you can get quite insecure about people judging your work, but then it's reflecting on you. If I hid behind the brands, then I could be a bit more experimenting and then they're like, who did this? So I can take more risks without it affecting me. And [00:12:00] obviously later on down the line, that's when the Dines kind of like brand was, was kind of built because now then I was like. The creative director of Studio BLUP when I had the time.

Matt: Got a long term collaborative business partner in that, and it sounds like you've got a very clear dynamic between you about who kind of takes responsibility for what. Was that something which organically happened? Because of the types of people that you are.

Dines: Yeah. Yeah. Well, listen, I joke with him, I say, basically he was my manager. So we used to like, [00:12:30] we on school, like, uni trips to say Amsterdam, we would go out at the night before with a class and we'll be a bit hungover, but he'll be like, Dines wake up, we need to go to his conference. And then like that kind of thing kind of fed in, so he was almost, like, the organized one in the relationship, right?

Dines: So we're best friends. I used to do his, uh, design work and he used to do my written stuff. So that collaborative thing was always a thing. Alex did a Masters on Studio BLUP, on me. Yeah. It was like, yeah, how this, how this guy who lived above a pizza shop in Southampton [00:13:00] started up a company working with, like, the biggest brands in the world.

Dines: And what did he do to do that? And he studied design business management. So he submitted, he wrote this dissertation and he submitted it and he got a distinction. And I was like, wow, man, like you've written your dissertation on me. I was like, look, before you get snapped up, how about making this official?

Dines: Let's do a 50/50 split. You can be like the guy that can look at contracts, make sure that we get paid, write any like project management emails, like I will teach you what I've been doing, but you just be the face of that. [00:13:30] So I literally taught him how to write an email. I taught him how to, like, just speak to clients.

Dines: And then what I can do is then I can just concentrate on the creative. But as time got on, the roles were blending, and we were getting quite frustrated because like we didn't understand what our relationship was. So, now we know it's like the visionary and the integrator, like we said earlier. And the visionary is about, um, doing the big stuff, coming up with the big ideas and the integrator is making stuff happen.

Dines: And when we defined those roles and understood it, when we read the books about it, it made it so [00:14:00] much more clear, because I was under pressure because I wasn't talking about money to like clients, and I was getting frustrated, I didn't know about finance and stuff. And then he was frustrated with himself because he's like, I can't do like as creative as Dine's, so where do we sit? But as soon as we established those roles, he became the expert in his field, I became an expert in my field, and then a perfect combination just happened. And then we just, yeah, flourishing to this day.

Matt: So is that something that you would recommend to people listening?

Dines: Yeah, well, it's time to change now, right? I was lucky that, um, I [00:14:30] had the relationship with my best friend, right? So we dreamt together. We were like, this is what we want to achieve. But now it's harder because the network is changing. People's ambitions are so much more higher than what it was 13 years ago. I say to people, I've got one business partner.

Dines: You're in a university, you've got thousands of collaborators and business partners there waiting for you. So think of you as the middle person and being the connector, and instead of just finding the one Alex, you've got seven. Instead of, like, just having a design team with just one [00:15:00] person, you know, a network of like 20 other graphic designers, tech designers, you're in a hub, so you use this to your advantage and that's one thing I didn't… I didn't do at university. Take that advantage of just how, how much talent there was that I could have collaborated and maybe got there quicker. 

Matt: But like network management and relationship management's a big part of it then.

Dines: A hundred percent. Like network, networking is the key.

Dines: And when I say, it's not just like going up to a random person in a bar. It's about having a plan. Um, if I have that end goal of like, okay, I want to meet [00:15:30] Obama one day, like how do I network using my talent to get to that stage where I'm one-on-one with Obama? You know, that's big ambitions for a lot of people.

Dines: When I'm in front of him, what do I show him to impress him basically? So having that network isn't just about the start of it, it's like, where's that going to take you and what doors are you going to open for the network that you build.

Matt: And within that, it sounds like you're very clear on your skillset, aren't you?

Matt: So is that important for people to be self reflective in that, not be too concerned about what they [00:16:00] perceive as their limitations? 

Dines: Yeah, 100 percent. So, the best thing is, like, to have the products, and your product is quite clear your talent or your ideas or the way you dress is you. You are the product. And you have to take time to build that and actually mold that into something that you're really proud of and keep developing it, right?

Dines: But once you have that core, you should be able to put that that core talent in front of anyone and speak about it proudly. Now when I say about networking, I never talk about [00:16:30] myself. I'm always always interested in the person I'm speaking to and because I'm listening and learning what, how, who they are, what they do, it's authentic. And at the end of it, they'll be like, oh, so what do you do Dines? I'm like, oh, let me show you. All right. So then that way it's just like, you're connecting authentically and then you're showing in the work and then you're, you're proud to show it because they're like, oh wow, I want to help this guy. I want to, like, collaborate with this guy. The worst thing is to go in speaking to someone and just, it's all about you. Because at the end of the [00:17:00] conversation, it'd be like, who's that guy? He'll like, well, he didn't ask me one question about myself. You have to have confidence in yourself. You have to have that product.

Dines: You have to have who you are so that people want to talk to you and don't rush that. And it will come. And so in the meantime, you start off small, create the conversation and then eventually, like I said, the vision is to speak to the top guy.[00:17:30]

Matt: I really wanted to talk to you a little bit about your creative practice now. Are you just producing work all the time, having ideas, making work, and then waiting for the right project to come along to then apply that work to, or is it more of a case of somebody approaching you and then you answering the creative problem that they've solved for you?

Dines: That's it, that's it, you've answered the million dollar question, all right? So, it's every bit of work that we've ever had through for Studio BLUP is come directly through inbound, right? [00:18:00] And, or me going out, speaking to someone and it's a phone call a year later. So it's like, Dines, I want you to work on this thing.

Dines: So, the reason why on our socials, that we're producing artwork is to shout so loud that we attract the creative director of a brand or producer of a certain brand. And then they'll probably save it, and they'll then put it in their mood boards and then they'll pitch it to their Creative Director and that Creative Director's like, Oh man, I love this.

Dines: And then it's the end of the conversation and it's like, okay, what can we do to [00:18:30] collaborate with you on your brand? There was a time when we were just trying to put like case studies up. It was getting zero engagement and it was boring, and my audience was saying like, Diane's like, we don't give, we don't care about a website that you've designed, like we want to see the art. And then I realized that is the secret formula, right? So we're designing, not, not just from myself, just, I don't care about engagement, I'm doing it because it's inspiring whoever's seeing it, and then eventually then they'll use that and move forward and then you'll get to work through.

Dines: So you've got to be consistent with that and you should [00:19:00] keep producing work, producing work, and then if you do a hundred, you'll probably get four phone calls from that. Don't expect it to happen, but it will happen. 

Matt: Yeah. And you've got to have faith in it. And it, and as you said, that consistency then is about a consistent creative voice so that you're speaking out into the world authentically as yourself, this is the work that I make and trust that the work willl come through as a result of that. Are there particular aspects of a brand that you're looking for that you want to [00:19:30] work collaboratively with? 

Dines: Yeah, well, we've worked with the best, I mean, the biggest companies in the world. Right. And there I say, it's amazing at a time. It's like, Oh my God, I've just got like an email from, like, Disney and I, this is, like, mind blowing.

Dines: But then after a while, it's like you would design something and it will last two weeks and it's gone and then move on to the next. And at the time, I just, I just had enough of that, and I said to Alex, I was like, how do we design stuff that has a bit more legacy? Like something that would last the test of time and not just be a campaign to make other [00:20:00] companies money.

Dines: And that's when we realized like Studio BLUP is the brand, like, we want to produce work for our own brand that we can like sell our merch, we can sell our products, we can sell the live workshops, we do talks around the world, and we're putting all our energy into making us known. All right. And then if you're doing that for yourself, then the brands would come knocking and say, like, we want you to apply that to yourself.

Dines: And what we say now is, okay, we're going to design something for you, but we want to collaborate with you. Like it needs to be a Studio BLUP X the brand, rather than us doing the work and it's [00:20:30] hidden and you release it. We want you to be proud of collaborating with studio blop. So we change our, like, philosophy of not just being about work. We call it colabs. And if you want a colabs Studio BLUP, you're going to connect to a new audience that are going to love your brand even more. So we are the value, added value to like the work that we're doing, and that's how we're going to connect you to the new culture. And that is the new strategy.

Matt: That's brilliant. I mean, yeah, well, that's great because obviously, instead of BLUP journeying from one brand to the other, you are the bus and these brands can get on and off the bus. [00:21:00] Could you explain a little bit about what Studio BLUP is and within that a little bit about how it operates and what your role as creative director is within that?

Dines: Yeah, sure. Okay, so the old Studio BLUP was a design agency. What we would then do is pitch an idea to a brand and then the brand would be like, okay, this is good, let's change it, and then we'll produce a campaign. For example, Kylie Jenner, with Kylie Jenner, Kylie Cosmetics, right? So I pitched an idea and say, said to them, how [00:21:30] about if we do a virtual shopping experience, like before the metaverse, where you scan the QR Code and you're in this like Kylie World and you can use your mobile phones, like look around, select a product, put it in your basket and then go into another room within this, like, AI app thing, go into it, learn how to do your makeup, blah, blah, blah. What I created there was an idea, pitch to a client, they pay for the development, we launched it. Then we had the Kylie Jenner name to our brand, and we use that then to talk to other beauty companies. And we teamed up with one of [00:22:00] my friends, a really close friend called Ru, who was the head of, like, creatives there.

Dines: And it was just like then convincing her, this is the right way to move your brand forward. So that was just a simple, like, sort of case study. We're now looking at Studio BLUP now as a creative company. It splits into three things. So it's the arts that we make, right? So that could be applied to products that could apply to campaigns, digital experiences. We innovate. Innovation, that's for, like, technology. So AI [00:22:30] experiences, any virtual reality stuff, and then we also educate. So with the BLUP Academy, which we'll speak about later, it's actually then inspiring a whole new generation to do what we do. So the art is the basis to inspire people to look at our brand, they'd be like, oh, I want to learn how to do that.

Dines: So we realized the art is the most important thing that we have to create to attract the new audience. So we've gone from a, uh, a design agency, which is just a normal design business to now a creative company.

Matt: But in terms of longevity and [00:23:00] legacy, it feels like that's a really important but quite sensible step as well to actually sort of think, what's the long term difference that BLUP can make.

Matt: And so as part of that BLUP Academy is launching in January. And so what are your sort of aspirations, your hopes for that side of things?

Dines: So long story short, we, uh, sold half a BLUP three years ago to a group and we've just bought it back. We've purchased our own company back, like, literally two weeks ago and we realized [00:23:30] like, when you are an owner of a company and you think it's all about the exit plan, you're not making a difference. You're just filling your pockets and just, it's just aimless. And I was, I, I didn't wanna do that. I've got a son now, five months old, and I look at his face, I'm like, yeah, I'm doing this, I'm doing amazing stuff, but how do I actually line up your future and make it a better world?

Dines: So I realized like, you know, when I was even doing Studio BLUP talks at universities across the world literally for 15 years, every time I go to university we're building a fan [00:24:00] base for people to respect. We're inspiring them to get the best mark, I said there's something in this. Anyway, so as soon as we brought back the Studio BLUP, I said this needs to be a thing now. We've got so much skin in the game that we need to teach the young talent how to do what I did, but the authentic way - the real way and no messing about.

Dines: It's just straight. This is how you network. This is how you build a brand. This is how you sort out your mental health. This is how you talk to someone. All these are going to be small little courses to hopefully make a [00:24:30] difference to that one person to then become, say the next Dines of their own brand.

Matt: Do you feel also that you're filling a specific gap? That just wasn't there when you're in your own development.

Dines: Yeah, I think it is. I think it's a bit of a rebellion. It's the rebel in me going back from the graffiti days, right? It's to just kind of push against the norm, and actually, when I'm talking to these students, you can see in their eyes they're lost and they're scared.

Dines: And once they're out in the big wide world, obviously you have universities that help it, but it's just like there are things that are missing to help creatives. It actually doesn't matter what industry you're in to [00:25:00] actually like go out there in the world and become someone and I think when you walk into a room and you're respected, that's what everyone wants to achieve in life, right?

Dines: And if you can do that via your talent, then that is what life is about and that is for me is what success is. Let's teach them the real way or the BLUP way we call it, of how to actually get out there and just have confidence in yourself to achieve anything.

Matt: It sounds like you're doing a brilliant job in demystifying and simplifying the game a little bit.

Dines: It's also about having a purpose, right? [00:25:30] So, you're waking up from an amazing night's sleep and you're like, okay, what do I need to do today to get to my goal? What is my true purpose? And I think when we release our courses, and we're gonna do like online tutorials, all that stuff, you can like log in and actually listen to a course and actually take your notes and do those daily mental exercises to actually go out into the real world and test it out.

Dines: Every day I want to achieve something every day. I want to just make sure that I'm fulfilling something to make myself proud, your family proud. And then all your friends proud. [00:26:00] I talk about money. I talk about like how to like save, how to charge for your work, learn how to sell your ideas to clients.

Dines: It's all about those things when you're in a room, what do you do to like close the business. 

Matt: Make a living that you've got bills to pay the same as anyone else. So so that's so that's I mean, it's fantastic to hear that's gonna be a big part of it.

Dines: I think that's the main thing that gets a lot of people down and it's a shame really but that's a reality. So, I've always said Alex and I was so broke that we had [00:26:30] bailiffs knocking at our door asking for electricity bill and we didn't pay it because we couldn't, because every bit of money we're making, we were reinvesting it back into our company and then going out to like a design conference in Paris, hoping that one day we get this one big bit of work that saves us all.

Dines: But that was a risk that we took, and it was all about eating the dirt, you know? Feeling what it feels like to have nothing, right? Not asking family or parents or borrowing money. It's just like, this is what it feels like to have absolutely nothing. So we realized then it's [00:27:00] like, okay, what's the easiest way to make a quick 4,000 pounds, right?

Dines: And was like, okay, let's find someone in the architecture world. And we offered to do their website and their logo and branding. And we realized that, okay, we're charged, say five grand. But then that five grand will last us three months of rent, minimum food, eating the yellow stickers from Tesco. But using that time then to develop our brand. So there's a bit of a cushion there, right?

Matt: It's interesting, just anecdotally, I went to, um, uh, at the British Museum a million years ago when I was [00:27:30] at uni and it was an evening with Alexander McQueen and he was talking about his time at London College of Fashion and LCF when he was doing his MA in pattern cutting there.

Matt: And he was just, like, on beans every day, and he said loads of the other students just couldn't hack it. They just couldn't deal with having no money, having no resources. And he just said he had to really dig into that sense of like, I can do this. If I just get through this bit, the next bit will be much better kind of thing.

Dines: You have to be [00:28:00] deluded. Like, you have to pretend that you are gonna make it. You have to, like, dream. I think faking it till you make it is, if you break that down, you're faking it to yourself and you're telling yourself like, I am going to be this guy. It doesn't mean you're going to be fake to someone.

Dines: They can see you can, you have to be vulnerable and you have to say, be honest, like, yeah, I'm eating shit at the moment, but I have to, I have, I have division and it is, yeah, it's a form of like faking it until when you make it, you can look back and be like, you know what? I didn't actually fake that. I've become the person that [00:28:30] I actually wanted to be.

Matt: And now that you're, you know, more comfortable position in that the brand is established, that the business is successful, do you ever access those old feelings of being broke, uh, hungry, you know, worried about money. Do you ever sort of just think back to those times to then find a motivation to keep going?

Dines: Yeah, yeah. So like, listen, it's, it's agency life at the moment is so hard. Like everyone's fighting for the same brand. Everyone's fighting to save money. It's getting cheaper and cheaper and cheaper. Like, [00:29:00] and people are struggling to the, in this, in this day and age, and this is like, how do… how do I protect Studio BLUP with what I know best, how do I protect my team? How do I protect my business partner? You know, what do I need to do, Dines to like, make sure that I'm innovating, having the right conversations, so then we’re never in that position? So it's that fear and being uncomfortable is the only thing that drives me. And then when you're staying too complacent, you then become irrelevant. Be uncomfortable, be unreasonable, that's my, that's my number one line.

Matt: Yeah I like it. That's [00:29:30] good. Yeah, that's good. So in terms of BLUP Academy, what can people expect to see there in terms of… what would it look like?

Dines: Yeah, yeah, so we want a little bit… so we first started a movement called the BLUP Gen and then we call that the new culture. So we would speak to, say, brands and say like, okay how do you stay [00:30:00] relevant to the new culture, the BLUP Gen? And the BLUP Gen consisted of people that I would recognise as top talent. Whether you're a student that's writing poetry, whether you're a florist, whether you're an actor, whether you're, like, a sneaker collector, I'm… me and Alex and the team are scouring over the internet, finding the next talent that's changing culture. They don't have to have thousands of followers.

Matt: It's about the work.

Dines: It's about what they are doing, what I did back in the day. So, giving them the BLUP Gen platform to then feel amazing about themselves and they can shout about it [00:30:30] and they have that platform to achieve greatness. So we were harnessing that and then we were connecting brands to speak to these talents, and then we would then write a brief together and then pitch it to the brand. So that was Blup Gen. And I realised like, hang on a minute, there's a big side we're missing where we're not teaching people how to get to that stage. So what we’re going to do is create a BLUP Academy, and a BLUP Academy is basically… just means you have courses on, like, overcoming lack of confidence, understanding how money works, [00:31:00] networking, all different types of courses that we're writing at the moment. And you can log in and do those courses and at the end of it, there's exercises that you have to do, submit to us, tag us on Instagram, whatever. And then we can keep an eye on your journey. And at the end of it, if you complete a course, you’re then part of, like, the BLUP crew

Matt: You get to be part of that community, that network that’s plugged in.

Dines: That's it. That's it. And then eventually we're going to do, like, awards. We're going to, we're going to throw, like, the sickest parties of the year, which we've been doing anyway for the past four years and celebrating that talent, celebrating that network. So BLUP Academy will be the one where hopefully it [00:31:30] will change someone's lives to then achieve and then change this industry and make it a better place.

Matt: Oh man, that's amazing. Well, look, I, I'm sure it's going to be a massive success, but yeah, absolutely best of luck with it. And it's fantastic that you're just kicking over so many of those obstacles that you talked about at the beginning in terms of things that you had to solve, in terms of where's my network, how do I, kind of, get my work seen? Did you have any mentors or people that kind of supported you?

Dines: Yeah, yeah. So, famously we had an amazing guy called Bill Walsgrove and he designed the [00:32:00] B&Q logo back in the day. So like, I remember when I first met him, we were just like “we really wanna be this guy who has been there, done it”. And what he done… he found, like, Studio BLUP and it inspired him and he was, like, a fan of our work and I was thinking, wow, you've got this guy who's actually, lik,e known in industry, that's, like, a fan of Studio BLUP, that wants to help us grow and talk, he's built and sold businesses. So he's the one that, like, said, “okay, this is what you guys need to do to make your agency commercial enough to make money”. So he taught us [00:32:30] about how to pitch, what you need to do, what does your deck need to look like. All that stuff that we didn't actually know. Cause I've never worked for anyone. I've never worked for an agency. So again, we were making it up. But when you have this guy… When you see him in meetings and he owns the room, he's confident and he's got a bit of banter about him, but then he'll make it serious. And then at the end of the day, he will close the deal. You're like, that's the type of mentor we need. Mentors are our key. And I think that you've, especially students that have [00:33:00] mentors, at the tip of their fingertips, right?

Dines: And they can ask to pull them aside for three minutes and just get your questions ready and just, like, learn from the people that surround them. But also reach out to people on social, and just, don't bombard them. Like don't do it on LinkedIn, like, actually try and find out where they are, if they're talking, whatever, and, and speak to them at the end of the talk.

Dines: And that's what I love when I speak to universities, I'm flooded with, like, just students. And they're using that time to ask me questions. And I'm like, this is sick, cause I didn't do [00:33:30] this. They're just so hungry to learn. Yeah. So yeah. So you have to find your mentor, go out there, look for it and attach themselves, but also make sure that they believe in you to achieve greatness.

Matt: And there's a sense in there about showing your commitment, isn't there? About going along to a talk, to a lecture, waiting afterwards, having a couple of questions prepared.

Dines: Yeah. Yeah. I did, just, a conference and it's so cute. We had these young talents, there was about five of them and they all produced a Studio BLUP poster. And they came up to me like, oh, we did [00:34:00] this, this poster for you. I was touched. You know what I mean? Because they've gone the extra effort and they want me to sign it and stuff. And I was like, this is how you do it. This is, like, the next level of getting to where you need to be, doing something that stands out, that makes you stand out from the rest from the crowd. And a little bit of extra effort, I will remember for the rest of my life. And, like, if I link up with them again, I'm like, yeah, you guys let me help you. I mean, so it's that extra effort that you’ve just got to dig into to stand out to shine so bright. Opportunities come towards you. [00:34:30]

Matt: Dines, we like to get everybody who's a guest to set a creative provocation to our listeners. So is there anything that kind of springs to mind that you'd like to challenge people with?

Dines: Yeah, okay. So, the first thing I’d love you guys to do is what do you want to achieve in the next three years? Think astronomical, think [00:35:00] huge.

Dines: So you're going to put together a little mood board with 15 images of you holding an award, you graduating with a first, you travelling all around the country, whatever you want to do to inspire you. The second stage is understanding how your mind works. So I would love for you to understand how meditation works to clear up the stress and the clutter from your brains. So, focus on what a 10 minute guided meditation is, you can go on YouTube and there's loads on it. And what you're doing is [00:35:30] understanding that meditation will slow your mind down to create space to think and not worry about anxiety, not worry about being depressed or being sad. If you feel like that, you know, you can actually just put a lid on it for five minutes and then use that space to create.

Dines: So, I want you to learn how your mind works and learn how to meditate and actually move forward. And the last one is how to develop a style. So, even if you're a creative or a fashion designer or photographer, I [00:36:00] want you to find 7 of your favourite photographers. Look at their story, find a new podcast, work back to the beginning, work out what did they do from the start to finish, who they know, what they did to get to the level they are and understand there's a journey. I want you to write that down and then match that with your vision board and know that you're going to be there in three years time.

Matt: Brilliant man, that's great. I'm going to do it, I'm going to go and make a moodboard

Dines: I want to see [00:36:30] it. Make sure you tag me.

Matt: Thank you Dines, honestly, there has been so many amazing insights and things to think about, actions to take. You're doing fantastic work. It's so important for the young people out there to have role models and mentors and people like yourself who are out there making it possible for them, so thank you ever so much.

Dines:I thank you guys for having me and thank you for what you're doing.

Matt: Thanks [00:37:00] again for listening to this episode of Teach, Inspire, Create. A massive thank you to Dines. It's a fantastic opportunity to speak to him and learn all about his own creative practice, the Blup Studio, and importantly, the new Blup Academy. If you want to know more about Dines or Blup Academy, you can visit www.dines.london or studioblup.com. You can find the link to these in our episode description. We really hope you enjoyed this episode of the [00:37:30] podcast. If you did, please share with someone else and rate us wherever you get your podcasts. So, it just remains for me to say thank you very much for listening and until next time, take care.